[Music]
hello hello hello everyone uh well thank
you for joining us um we are here to
discuss um about how intents or or
intents are reshaping the user
experience uh in Defi and from
simplifying complex operations or
complex transactions in in blockchain uh
to increasing
security and oh thank you and improving
decentralization so I'm very happy to be
here and I'm very happy to be joined by
this group of experts who are uh
collaborating with leading protocols on
this matter so if it's okay for you we
can start with uh with introductions
brief introductions from from uh all of
us I will let you uh start probably uh
Sean do you want to
start
yeah hey okay cool um hey guys I'm Sean
I work at orbs I've been um in the space
since uh 2018
uh doing a bunch of stuff I have no web
2 experience so I've been doing it live
since um since then and just kind of
learning as I as I go along it's been um
a lot of fun um at orbs what we're
building um is is kind of we kind of
call ourselves a L3 for onchain trading
um what that actually means in practice
is we uh build protocols for D5 Pro for
for D um so we have advanced order types
um for dexes uh so two op and limit
orders um we have another protocol
called liquidity Hub that uses um that's
intent in nature in terms of it
Aggregates all the liquidity on chain we
use par swap as a good friend of ours
for that and um and then we're we're
doing some stuff now with um with pers
as well that's also intent based so yeah
really excited glad to be up here guys
um thanks for inviting me thank you uh
Julie do you want to introduce yourself
yep okay uh hi everyone nice to be here
too thanks for the invitation I um I
work at mimic and I'm in the whole
Partnerships Communications PR part of
the protocol so at mimic we're a defi
automation protocol and what we do is we
simplify day-to-day operations by
automating and what we're doing right
now is we are launching our newest
version which is launching our protocol
and we would like to everyone to start
trying and see the full experience of
How It's like to automate on Defi and
make it easier for people to interact
more and get more access to it and and
instead of being like this complex idea
that we have and make it more like uh
day to-day and basically make it easier
yeah cool thank you thank you for
joining Dom uh hey everyone I'm Dominic
um I'm the head of ecosystem at lifi um
we are a bridge and deex aggregator so
generally a liquidity aggregation
protocol um our main usage
is having any to any swaps um across all
the major chains and ecosystems we
support evm Solana and Bitcoin right now
um expanding further into other
ecosystems um we do have Lei itself is a
B2B product mostly integrated um with
big wallets and applications and then it
also Powers jumper. exchange which is
our own front end interface um which is
catered to end
users great thank you uh thank you for
for your introductions for joining us uh
myself I'm uh I'm a I'm leading the
operations and the partnership teams at
Paras swap Paras swap it's a defi
aggregator and we not so recently but
it's a kind of new released our intense
trading uh solution uh that it's built
uh on top of porticus which is uh
providing the intense infrastructure for
this and why is this important uh for
Paras swap Paras swap is leveraging
Paras swap Delta the trading the intense
trading solution and this enables our
users to uh trade gasless and trade with
me protection with it would it wouldn't
be possible without
intents um so and and it's not a
coincidence that we are all sitting here
because we are partnering with between
all of all of our protocols uh to
leverage intents and to bring uh better
user experience uh in different use
cases so having done this uh these
introductions what uh where where
probably we can start is we know intents
uh will be uh or are tackling the most
important or one of the most important
challenges uh in defi which is user
experience
so besides tackling this issue and when
we simplify with intense complex
transactions or complex operations we
are lowering the entry barriers for new
users and we are also lowering the
existing barriers for existing users so
what I wanted to discuss with you is uh
how are you seeing intents improving the
user experience in your protocols and
from your perspective which kind of
barriers are we lowering for new
users yeah so um I think the first step
is starting with like breaking down kind
of like what are the parts of this like
intent based user flow right you already
said it um for the most part um
important parts of it is a gasless
transaction um it is um a
signature-based transaction scheme um
and then on the other hand um what is
almost like equally used with the word
intense is um the term solver which
basically is some type of entity call it
a market maker routing mechanism or
whatever that then is able to actually
fulfill these complex order types or
sess liquidity um that we're talking
about right um at Lei where we're mostly
interacting um in a cross-chain
environment um for us the most important
Point probably is um that gas
abstraction um we're actually going to
launch um our own version of gas
abstraction in
the next two weeks probably um and also
we are integrating a gas zip into our
routing um and and use that for gas
refueling on on other chains um which if
you're interacting in a cross chain
environment is very important because
you might want to trade on a chain um
that you've never been on so you don't
have any gas in your account there um so
this this is a very complex and
difficult problem or it used to be a
very complex and difficult problem as
many of you probably know
um so for me those are kind of the most
important issues that we can um solve
with intents um and then there's
probably more complex use cases um on
top of that that these two teams are
tackling which yeah they can talk
about yeah well I can continue because I
can take your point and reaching more
use cases which is basically what we're
aiming by using the well the mimic infra
and by partnering with you guys is the
possibility to scale on that and the
whole that decentralization but it's
really like important for the user to
know what it what it needs to be done so
if you know what action you want to take
what intent then all the rest can be
taken careed of and that's what def is
about and that's what we're aiming with
this not only for users that know how
dii works but for those also that don't
know about it but want to get into so if
you know what slippage you want to set
what first goal you want to set and that
makes it much easier in the whole
interaction yeah so um for us at orbs we
have um I mentioned at the beginning
that we have an onchain sort of
aggregator it's for spot markets um and
we actually integrate that directly with
Dex uis um so it's called liquidity Hub
it's on um quick swap uh uh spooky swap
on Phantom if you guys remember that
there's a phantom chain and it's not
just a wallet um I got as that earlier
that's why I'm chuckling about it um as
well as um Thea on BMB um and so when
users come to swap on these dexes um we
do an RFQ on the back end on on orbs
layer 3 rather we call I don't know we
call it a back end um and that uh kind
of abstracts the complexity of having
users need to go to an aggregator um and
and search for the best price themselves
um in addition to this um we also have
got gasless transactions as I think
everyone else up up here has mentioned
um and I think these two things are are
really um kind of the core the the
underscoring of of what we're
doing great so uh it's uh it's not a
coincidence that the three of you
mentioned uh abstracting complexity from
users uh from different different
different in different ways uh in order
to make their lives EAS easier uh and
maybe not have them deciding on things
that they don't care that much or most
users don't care that much and myself
personally I have found myself in uh not
having gas on the destination chain when
bridging and that blocking me from doing
whatever I was trying to do having to
set up uh lots of uh uh configurations
that probably I don't care or I prefer
that someone else decides for me um and
when using different dexes uh not having
to maybe go to a meta agregator but
rather going through something like a
liquidity Hub so I can I can get a
better a better quote and so I think we
are on the path with intents on
different protocols in different ways uh
to simplify this uh this
experience what um what I see from from
my personal view is I see lots of
protocols that are uh adopting intents
uh and this is kind of uh it has come a
rise it has become a race of uh speed of
innovation versus scalability so
deploying intents or implementing
intents uh it's not easy it's not
something that can be done from one day
to the other so what I wanted to to ask
you is about your point of you regarding
the speed of deployment the speed of
innovation versus the um scalability and
how to design uh scalable solutions that
can leverage intents in the future uh
have you have you
found um how you find trouble
implementing this how you found trouble
in finding Scala Solutions and how did
you solve
those yeah um I can start um I think the
the way that we look at that um is
probably the one where there's the most
problems with this as our like frame of
reference is kind of a multi-chain
environment and um I mean it starts with
just like it starts with finding
something that can work on um all the
chains that you want to be on right and
let let's maybe start out just talking
one execution environment let's say we
we just stay within the evm even then
that means if if something like Lei is
you know expanding to new chains and we
use something like Gip for example to um
have this kind of like refuel feature
that means that
um Gip needs to scale with our own
expansion right so we are mostly an
aggregation protocol so we don't build
things ourselves necessarily but more
and more so we found ourselves in kind
of that tough spot where you have to
start building things yourself or you
have to build something that's more
similar to a Marketplace which is kind
of like what Paras is building
um to attract solvers to attract agents
that can execute these transactions
across many many chains so when we start
from there
um obviously we have certain Pathways
that are very crowded right like every
solver wants to solve on Bas every
solver wants to solve on arbitrum every
solver you know eventually wants to
solve on like bar chain or Monet
whenever these chains are launching um
for the more long tale of
chains um that's probably more difficult
um there might have to be different
solutions of how to do that and then the
other issue of scalability that comes to
be is
like how do you do that cross different
virtual machines um and how do these
agents and the protocols that have the
marketplaces start talking to each other
across these environments and then we
have to go into something like message
passing um we have to go into something
like building multiple versions of these
protocols so um I think when it comes to
this end of the scalability we're still
pretty early um and nobody has like
really figured that out yet but um if
you think about it we just talked about
how these intent types basically make
the ecosystem much more much easier to
use where ecosystems where you don't
have all these things yet you kind of
it's It's kind of the similar the
difference between a transaction and
intent right is like you have to find a
pathway yourself still which makes it
like much harder to navigate these um so
yeah I think it's it's in some ways if
somebody can build something that
abstracts all of that way across all
these different environments that's
probably like the Holy Grail of that
entire Market of like liquidity routing
but it's a really really tough problem
to
solve okay so you are focusing on the
composability of that uh of that
ecosystem besides improving the external
experience for user you are also
focusing on improving this composability
for the protocols that need to connect
to to to yeah like just think about
something as I said earlier we support
Solana evm and Bitcoin but that also
means that currently the user has to um
use three different wallet types because
you need a phantom wallet whatever on
Solana and then you need a Bitcoin
wallet need whatever you're using on the
evm um the end game of this is to have
some kind of signature abstraction game
that allows you to basically compos
signatures across multiple chains
probably with something like ZK proofs
or MPC or whatever you um prefer
cryptographically um and that's kind of
like the next level of intense in a way
because that's kind of what you guys are
doing right you abstracted it on DVM but
the next level is how do you make it
even more composable across these
different ecosystems that's
correct okay so the way we see it is
more about if you want to like lower
that barrier entrance maybe you need to
think it as for example if you're in a
room you want to communicate to another
room if you feel like like two isolated
things right if you find the way how to
communicate with those like then you can
communicate to others too right and you
can get to more and more and more places
so it's about looking at that connector
and it may happens all the time with all
of our times we have and all the people
that want to say hey I want to automate
I want to do this and that we act as
intermediaries to the solution so
intents for us are that that looking for
that path that execution plan that you
want to have and seek the best way to
get all those connections and get to
more and more use cases scalability
cation so kind of uh standardizing those
connections so using the same connection
that you have from one room going going
to the example from one room to the
other but also to connect other other
partners for you for example yeah it's
going like like KN how we have in like
it happens with some protocols and then
we can like have the experience that we
have with one and then standardize it in
order like to reach more and access like
more information on
that
great yeah so for sorry so for us um I
think the biggest thing was um for for
liquidity Hub um we'd have um dexes that
really really want to integrate um the
the the the protocol on on their UI but
then you know when we look at the actual
chain itself there's maybe only one or
two um solvers there that are that are
facilitating orders on on the on the
Chain so for you know for something like
polygon where um you know we have
everyone added um odos open uh oos open
oer Power Swap obviously um and offchain
liquidity as well it's like very easy um
but like what D is saying when you go to
these like further and further chains
where there's just not as much of an
ecosystem buil built up there um you
know there there's there's only so much
uh there's only so many pools that you
can that you can reach um and you know
and then taking that one step further um
you know to bring offchain liquidity
into these pool into this Marketplace is
even like another crazy step um and and
requires a lot of uh development effort
and and and OB obviously Capital um so
from our perspective um that that's been
the biggest the biggest and and most
challenging hurdle
but it actually I think it actually
makes sense that you start with the
let's call it the lwh hanging fruit
where that you can integrate easily and
and fast and then you move into the more
complex but probably the ones that will
that you select or you prioritize the
ones that will be adding more value uh
to your to your ecosystem and you focus
on on implementing uh
those um thank you uh if if I may add
here something that I think it's
important for scalability and it's a
concept that we didn't mention uh it's
the concept of modularity so I think
modularity is going to play an important
role in in the intense uh
scaling um for example the the
infrastructure that Paras swap is
leveraging to enable uh intents uh it's
a modular infrastructure what does this
means it's uh it means for example that
the swap module that Paras swap it's
leveraging to enable intents uh it's a
module that was built exactly with this
use case exactly for this use case uh if
we want to enable other uh modules then
we need to develop that module and it's
probably easier to escalate things by
module rather than just escalating all
the use cases uh at once uh so I think
uh modularity will play an important
role because you can think about
modularity then you can start connecting
the different modules and I go to the to
the connecting rooms that you were
saying um if you start connecting mod
mod and each module enables a use case
let's say uh swap module Bridge module
cross chain module uh you can start
mixing the usage of this module to
enable different features uh on the
different protocols UI so I think that
would be an important concept that at
some point it's going to be uh more
spreaded uh around the intense
ecosystem um now now I want you I I want
to take you out of your protocols uh
and make a question that it's more
related to more related to the general
experience through intents so when we
when we talk about simplifying user
experience uh taking the specifics out
of the hands of the users and leaving
that to a third party I kind of feel
related to a web to experience uh where
we have centralized entities centralized
actors that decide for the user that
take complexity out of users but decide
for users so at some points I found
myself talking about intents and remind
me of the experience we have in web 2 so
how how do you think we should find the
balance or the switch spot of making
users experience better easier but not
losing or not uh yeah not losing the
decentralization that Defi and ethereum
have already uh
establish as a kind of a
standard yeah I mean I mean first of all
if we go from like the solver based
system um generally it takes a lot of
risk out of um or away from the user
because
um the way that these um systems usually
work is a solver basically more or less
instantly fills prefills um the
transaction that the user requests um in
kind of like an RFQ system as you said
and then um on the same chain obviously
they're usually more or less Atomic so
there isn't too much risk there um once
you go across multiple chains um there
might obviously be some kind of finality
problems and now the solver takes on
these finality risks that the user um
had before and um the solver as a more
professional Market making entity should
be better equipped to
basically calculate um this finality
risk um and then settles through some
type of you know intense settlement
layer mechanism um so I think from that
perspective there there isn't too much
risk for the user um I think where the
risk becomes
more prevalent is when we start thinking
about competition as you said earlier um
on a chain um that is smaller um there
might only be like one or two solvers
okay one solver I think everybody here
can see the problem with that it's
basically a monopoly so the solver can
just quote you and obviously he has an
information advantage over you unless
you're very sophisticated you don't
really know if that price you're getting
quoted right now is a good price for you
or not unless you go back to basically
doing all the research that you would
have to do yourself in a transaction um
based um system but even let's say if
there are two or three solvers um the
the problem of collusion could still be
pretty prevalent where the solvers just
basically talk to each other and they're
like hey look let's all just like quote
a little bit higher price and we skim
some money of the user
and then we share that in the end so for
solver systems to actually um
sufficiently work we need a competitive
market and creating a competitive market
is um a question of you know demand at
the end of the day if there's enough
demand then enough solvers will show up
um but also on their end it becomes
about like scalability of infrastructure
again where you know demand might pop up
anywhere at any point in time and a lot
of that is like uninformed flow in a
sense so I think Dux can look good but
it's kind of like getting scammed in a
taxi you know you really have to know
the environment like if you guys grab a
taxi here in Thailand you're not a local
you don't know the prices how would you
know if you're getting scammed right now
or
not so uh you would put the focus in
decentralizing the the whole
infrastructure I would say or increasing
the the competitiveness of the
competition increasing I think yeah
competition is more important than
decentralization from a perspective of
you know like competition could also be
great between tree solver if the system
is designed well enough that they cannot
collude with each other so yeah
designing the system in a way that keeps
everybody competitive with each other is
very
important makes sense thank
you um the way I think about it and
short experience I have like um well
recent experience in web 2 and now web
free is that user experience is really
important in web 2 but for web free it's
getting there it's improving a lot but
if you need to risk something will be
that and main focus should stay on
transparency and that's thing with
centralization and everything but it's
really important to be transparent and
if there's competition and everything
and everything like keeps going forward
and we improve and we get better in
models and everything I think that
that's like the most important thing
that we should focus and especially when
we're doing this kind of things right
and it's like money from others and you
keep put the Uber taxi example and the
taxi where you know it really well the
Uber not so much so it's like but if we
don't know it so well so if we keep
transparent and it's better and it will
get you more users eventually one one
maybe one more point that I just
realized um adding onto this is the
advantage that blockchains don't have is
once the transaction is settled and
inscribed in the blockchain it's there
so that data will be available forever
so unlike web 2 where maybe we have that
kind of obscured and we don't really
know somebody could actually go in and
kind of prove to you later on that you
were getting scammed and this is a huge
Advantage obviously that blockchains
have over like as an open system over
maybe the more closed systems and web
tool if if I may if I may complement uh
what what you are saying um it feels it
feels a bit like uh we are simplifying
and taking complexity out of users but
at the same time we need to be
transparent about how we are building
the protocols which can be which can end
up being more complex for the user to
understand that the initial let's say
slipage or gas gas setup so I think the
the the the point here is that we need
to make sure that the infrastructure or
the uh or the ecosystem is decentralized
or it has enough competitors so they
canot collude or they cannot screw the
users but uh it's more for making sure
that the user experience is going to be
good rather than to explaining that to
everyone or to the users because uh I
don't know how
how how we would explain how a complex
system like an intent system worked to a
retail user for example I I don't I
don't know how we would find the
way I think um I think ux is super
important and like I don't I don't think
anything that I I don't think NE
necessarily that you know you you never
want to at least with intense you don't
want to ever compromise that ux that
users have now at least um you know you
have a better price so you want to keep
the better price and you have this
better user experience it's better than
having to to search for it yourself it's
it's much easier for for for everyone I
would say just to add on to what
everyone else has already kind of echoed
but um just just the way that these
Protocols are designed to make sure that
they they're open um that there's clear
documentation so that there's not it's
not like an airline industry where the
barrier to entry is like you know it's
not possible um so you know if someone
wants to be a solver if someone wants
them um route liquidity if someone wants
them if a market maker wants to earn uh
money this way that that that there's
clear
documentation um and that Protocols are
set up to um be open you know and and
have these these ethos that we're that
we're kind of discussing and
decentralization um so that they can
easily easily do so but I think like a
pattern that emerges here is like you
just said we're taking complexity away
from the user we're giving the
complexity to the system so you know
there's no um in you know in alchemy
there's like the the concept of an
equivalent exchange you know you can't
you can't just like gain something
without losing something else so you
can't just make you act like super good
without with without increasing the
complexity somewhere else right but what
we're basically doing here is we're
taking that complexity into the back end
and as you said for for example like you
want to keep that system open okay that
sounds great like right we all want open
systems but now let's what happens for
example if you keep the system open a
solver says I'm going to fill this order
and then doesn't fill it right so like
that means now if you keep the system
open that means you need to implement
something like slashing and then it
becomes kind of a a game of consensus
where you're almost
basically you're kind of building a
blockchain at the end of the day you
build you rebuilding consensus into that
in some way because you have agents that
are kind of like validators in a sense
and they do certain tasks and you have
to make sure um that they can be like
properly incentivized and then also
properly um you know slashed or whatever
if they misbehave which I mean in in
some ways it's great because you it
means you can add a token onto the stuff
at some point you know but but you went
from from infrastructure to uh kind of
Economics of the of the of the protocol
yeah that's that's what I do
sometimes um okay uh we have uh we have
few minutes left and I want to leave
some time for for questions so my last
question would
be I believe that the intense ecosystem
it's uh just starting so we're probably
going to see a lot of innovation in the
future so uh where do you see this
Innovation happening in the short to
midterm uh and also how do you balance
this uh with security risks that may
come uh with new features new products
um or new uh improvements that intents
can
bring uh sorry so I think I think um so
looking ahead I think
um we're now kind of building at orbs
anyways we're we're we're we think that
the next thing is onchain perpetuals um
so like if you look at like spot spot
Market to sex volumes it's like I think
about like I don't remember off the top
of my head but it's it's significantly
more than it's huge yeah it's huge it's
huge on dexes it's it's much larger than
the than the percentage of um Perpetual
trading happening on dex's um which is
about like 1% and the other 99.9% is on
is on is on centralized exchanges um so
we think that there's like one there's a
huge Market opportunity here uh people
want to trade um uh per on chain because
you know there's a lot of counterparty
risk that you have with Sexes as yeah I
don't I don't think we need to go down
the memory lane um so we can skip over
that for now but yeah yeah so I think
that for us this is kind of where we're
headed in in this
direction um and yeah in terms of uh
security risks it really just depends on
the protocol at the end of the day so
yeah is that uh kind of an alpha that
you're giving I mean you could take it
as that it depends on on how you want to
look at it um yeah I saw something on
Twitter that was like I think it was
like the GMX model is like um like like
some of the pools are getting like
locked or something as we're in like an
up only Market um so you know and Tents
are potentially potentially the way the
way that that that it's going to be yeah
I mean there's a lot of Builders around
it still so so yeah
thank
you okay I'm going to bring a concept
that eventually was going to be in our
conversation it's going to be
Ai and with nimic right now we're
building a free layer protocol with
intents in Ai and the idea is to create
the best execution plan in order for the
user to later have the control and like
delegate what you want to do and
everything but then you have the control
to sign and then executed so that's the
main role in security that we have and
super important because we want to give
the US for that control but we also have
all the track record from before we've
been in the market for three years we
know how stuff is done and we know how's
the best way to with the mimic
safeguards to have it all like back up
and making sure the user doesn't need to
worry about that because of course it's
like a concern and everything but it's
like you want to have someone that
that's got your back so that's like the
the main thing for us and that's what
we're building right now and we're
launching the protocol because we're a
business to business model and we've
been with that and we're going to
continue with it but we want to give the
opportunity to more users to build on
top of the protocol and connect and be
able to to do this stuff do we have a
date for the launch of their protocol
it's going to be next year okay you can
like check our socials and we're going
to be sharing more information sorry I'm
from com so of course I'm going to say
that but okay thank you but yeah it's
coming soon and it's going to be good
cool you you the last one to give us
some Alpha okay um yeah I mean I think
the alpha for any type of protocol that
is within the interoperability space um
is pretty much the same um I feel like
every protocol is working on like some
level of First Chain abstraction
um I mean that's something that we're
looking into I I do not really like the
term chain abstraction itself I think
it's more like chain agnosticism um
because like chain abstraction means
that the end user doesn't care about the
chain at all but like with the current
state of crypto that's not really true
users do usually still care what chain
they're on for either tribal reasons for
reasons of like wanting to farm
something uh for security reasons um so
um I think we want to at least give um
users and that also means companies that
work with us the ability to be
opinionated about like completely
abstracting this away or just partially
abstracting this away and then the other
thing that I talked about earlier a
little bit was like going into virtual
machine abstraction like and that to me
is like the end game actually um having
a unified experience of accessing all of
like the crypto world World um and yeah
as stated probably some kind of proving
schemes um hopefully ZK proofs becoming
cheaper is going to play a huge role in
this and I think in like the
next let's say 18 months we're going to
see like the first truly unified
accounts like you know people use the
word unified account right now but it's
really just an evbm balance um but like
unified account across all um virtual
machine
environments great thank you I think I'm
I'm the only one missing to give some
Alpa uh but as is also related to AI so
uh AI agents are plan of are part of our
of our road map uh think of an AI agent
as uh an entity that can execute complex
uh strategies uh in in favor of the user
so imagine uh DCA on on a on a certain
tokens so be able to buy in at certain
points of time and doing this leveraging
the security and the decentralization of
intents um so we are also going into a
AI through through
intents so I think we have a little gift
for you uh we prepared the poop for the
talk uh I hope there are some poop
lovers
here
so uh you should you if you have the po
app I think you can scan this QR uh to
get a memory of uh this panel that you
just attended so uh besides thanking you
for attending this uh panel I want to
also thank you uh the three of you
because it was a a very very good talk
uh and now maybe we can have some
questions if there are some
hello yeah uh my name is Jason and uh
and the topic about the int Trad is very
interesting uh uh so uh I'm I'm very new
here and I just have one question is is
that uh uh why you uh when you do kind
of uh intend trading uh does it mean
that you shift the uh you know um on the
uh on the kind of uh risk of uh uh
centralization to the backend system and
uh and as as I know uh using backend is
quite uh you know very um uh using backp
and in the system would bring the best
uh user experience uh in trading but it
will bring some downside and I just want
to hear more about it because uh it's
very important to us to improve our user
experience you do you get my
question um if I got it correctly it's
uh it's about you're asking if we are uh
leaving the centralization for the back
end is that is that the is that the
question yeah that's my question okay
yeah I think it depends what you mean
here I think like obviously like every
every intense system is at the end of
the day an aggregation system and every
aggregation system obviously strives to
be the sole owner of orderflow um so
like if you imagine there to be one of
those systems that would be better than
all the other ones and obviously if you
talk talking from a solver perspective
some of these systems are going to have
more Network effects than others um then
yes there is definitely like some kind
of centralization risk that like a
winner might take this entire Market but
the thing is like as we said this back
end will probably be some type of chain
with some type of consensus mechanism um
so if you look at it from that
perspective um it's more of an uh
it's more of it's more of a a
competitive system but yes in terms of
an API you would access probably a
simple a single API to um get quotes
from the
system uh if I may add there I think
that
uh there will be improvements on the
decentralization of the intents existing
systems uh I think that today uh it's
difficult to fully decentralize
an intense system mainly because of the
risk that we describ here that uh you
cannot ensure that suddenly from one day
to the other you have a thousand solvers
doing whatever they want on the on the
system um but I think it's going to be
Progressive So today we're here on the
decentralization uh the the intent
system are going to slowly start uh to
decentralize the different parts of the
of the back end until we have until we
find a solution that it's a completely
or almost completely Ely decentralized I
highly doubt that at some point you
won't have any API to access that it's
not centralized but I don't know maybe
maybe uh I'm wrong thank you for the
question so we have two more questions
here so the next question is are intents
the future of all of defi or are there
use cases where smart contracts are
still
useful any of you can take
it uh I think I think both can coexist
uh both use cases might be uh able to
coexist um there are today some use
cases um I don't know flash loans for
example that might not be might not be a
good fit for intents or how the intents
uh systems are working today but I think
it's uh at some point there is going to
be interest or prioritization of these
kind of different use cases uh but it's
going to be one by one um so I think
they might they might coexist uh in a
world where um where both use cases can
can still uh have I actually think they
have to exist right like because
liquidity is still going to be in like
Unis swap unless it's like an offchain
unless everything becomes an offchain fq
system which might happen but like even
then let's say you want to borrow some
money then you have to go to AA you want
to do some kind of YN type of Vault
stuff that you like basically intense
and smart contracts are just they're not
really con connected in that sense right
smart contracts are protocols or
nowadays also accounts if we talk about
account abstraction and something like
that the intent really is just the way
how you express your preferences that
that is what an intent is but that that
isn't necessarily connected to Smart
contracts in anyway smart contracts are
how we build
um expression of something on chain it's
just like a programming language thing
at the end of the day which the other
thing is like what do I want is a
preference um
expression okay so we have one more
question are Merkle trees the answer for
cross
intentions again anybody can take I
honestly I I don't have a an opinion
about the how to solve the cross chain
intentions uh I mean merries are
probably going to be out of it um in
expressing certain things as I said
earlier I think the answer for cross
chain intentions are probably ZK
proofs okay yeah that makes sense uh so
we have a question from there yeah just
just a question like do you see intense
in anything beyond defi other than def
have you seen anything any intents being
used Beyond
D I have heard about some use cases
but all theorical I mean I I never saw
them uh really implemented but I heard
uh and I've been pitched about some uh
like real world use cases where you can
I don't know rent for example an
apartment with uh uh with through
intents um but I think we are not there
yet uh I think I'm sure that we are not
there yet because we are not seeing them
being uh implemented in that way but I
think it can it can be uh work it can
work for other stuff besides D5 besides
uh I don't know lending borrowing
besides those use cases I think they
might work at some point I think the
technology has to uh has to evolve in
order to take it to other to other
places I mean if you think about it like
Skys scanner is an intent-based
application you go in there you put a
flight in and it says you it gives you I
mean the difference between intent in in
some ways would be the way we see
intents is like the solver just fills
you the best one and like in Skys
scanner you get a couple of options of
flights but in similar ways how lei for
example works today is you go in and you
say I want to go from asset a on chain a
to asset chain B on chain B and we still
give you options we just don't pick like
basically we we're not an opinionated
solver as to we don't give you one
option we give you multiple options that
you can pick from but that's still you
still give us an intent and we process
that intent and like every type of
aggregation protocol in web 2 more or
less works in the same way like I want
to buy an insurance and then Insurance
aggregator gives you you know a couple
of options so like intents are not in
anyway web tree specific they're just
like a way of solving um user
experience I think uh doubling down on
your example of Skys scanner something
that in might soul for example is I want
to travel to this destination for this
amount of time and I want to stay in
these places and have the whole solution
built for you like book your book your
uh airplane tickets book your hotel uh
book the stuff that you want to do and
reserve your uh your dinners or lunch in
restaurants that would be like the uh
the the ideal world of an intense um I
think it might it might happen at some
point but I don't know when or
how yeah maybe you can say something
because that's kind of the AI use case
at the end of the day The Skys scanner
thing
was I used to use it like all the time
but yeah I mean intend is an intention I
mean it depends on what context it is
but defi abroad other like cases yeah
we're not there yet I think we'll see
but you want to say something I I think
we're yeah I think we're good
we agree we
agree say goodbye yeah so any more
questions we have one more minute
here if not we can thank the speakers
again thank you so much for the
wonderful talk and thank you