[Music]
hello thank you thank you all for being
here thank you all for
coming um I uh I saw the presentation by
Amber B and Patrick neelen yesterday and
there was a really good joke when they
got to the part of their presentation
was that was about their own project
Amber was talking and Patrick stopped
her and interrupted and said have we
reached the Shilling
Point uh so my talk today is 100% about
zcash so it's like all Shilling
Point um but not in the sense of uh
asking you to buy more to pump the price
but uh to share a bunch of stuff that
we've learned recently in cryptography
and in regulation that everyone else can
hopefully reuse and benefit from okay
first of all uh can we bring up the
house lights so I can see you better
I can see these people all right will
everyone please put down your phone and
stand up for a
minute you and ZZ 99 up there would you
please put down your phone and stand up
for a
minute okay everyone except that guy
have stood up okay good uh if you have
never heard of zcash will you please sit
down okay great wow okay so if you've
heard of it but that's really like
you've just heard of it but you don't
know any anything about it would you
please sit
down so it's like a 10th okay sweet so
uh then I can skip that part which is
good because I was practicing my talk
this morning and I found out oh like the
rest of you can sit down too thanks but
don't get your phones out leave the
phones out away uh yeah I was practicing
my talk and I realized that I put like
an hour's worth of content into the
slides and that we have 28 more minutes
and I want a lot of questions so I'm
going to talk too fast and skip a lot of
the technical content
but the goal is to say uh what we've
just recently accomplished in
cryptography a couple pointers to
possible future work that other people
might also want and then talk about the
regulatory
situation so what we've just now
accomplished zcash as you all know
except for that guy and like 10% of
these guys is a separate
cryptocurrency that uh includes
encryption and cryptography to make all
the transactions private and it was
launched 2 years in 4 days ago on
October 28th so zcash is 2 years old and
that makes it like ethereum a grizzled
veteran of the space um and uh and four
days ago on Zach's second birthday we
introduced the first major upgrade which
is called sapling or zcash 2.0 and the
Improvement so the first thing we did
which most of you probably kind of know
is we pioneered the use of zero
knowledge proofs just real quick raise
your hand you know what is zero
knowledge proof is or you've heard of it
or whatever great this is great what a
great audience
um so I'm really proud that zero
knowledge proofs are so widely
appreciated for what they could
potentially do today because zcash was
the first application of them to
anything in the real world as far as I
know that was two years ago but the
first version we put out two years ago
was not efficient enough it took 37
seconds on a like supercomputer laptop
and it was not even possible on a mobile
phone to generate the zero knowledge
proof necessary to protect a single
zcash
transaction uh so what we've just
activated on mainnet 4 days ago is zcash
2.0 and we've reduced the time from 37
seconds in the first version to 2.3
seconds in the new
version thanks yeah so that's really
great because now it's possible for
people to generate these on their mobile
now no one's actually implemented it and
made available there's not a a client
yet for someone to download and use but
the cryptography has made it possible to
implement that client and for every
exchange everywhere to support these
zero knowledge proof based transactions
and so forth bye Corey and
um oh Cory's just getting ready because
he's next
um so real quick the there are basically
three components of the cryptog graphy
uh that we have worked on for the last
two years we have a really really great
team of cryptographers and Engineers
who've been working on this really hard
for two years straight to get us this
far so it's really uh a substantial
advance that everyone else can benefit
from because it's all open source all
the science results we had to come up
with have been published in
peer-reviewed science papers uh we
didn't apply for any patents and there's
no barriers to anyone else reusing this
for any other purpose um um okay the
three major advances we had to do uh the
first one is replacing the hash function
inside the so-called circuit that you
have to prove when you make a
transaction and um this is potentially
useful for a lot of other people because
hash functions are used everywhere a
great cryptographer once said that hash
functions are like the nails of the
internet they're used to hold everything
together uh there's nothing you do that
doesn't have at Le one hash function
inside um well two of our cryptographers
came up with uh a more efficient way to
make to implement a certain kind of hash
function called a Peterson hash inside
of zero knowledge proofs and all by
itself this reduced the runtime by 75%
which is a really great
Improvement uh you might be able to use
this yourself but you have to be careful
because shot 56 and Peterson have
slightly different properties so it's
not just a simple dropin replacement for
every use uh and the result of uh like 9
seconds per like per payment is still
not quite good enough so we kept looking
for a couple of other innovations that
would improve the performance uh while
being safe enough
and practical enough that we would be
able to deploy it the next one well this
is a complicated slide I'm going
to gloss over this but this is a bundle
of a proving system which is a snark
that's bctv 14 which we upgraded to
Groth 16 14 2014 and 2016 are the years
that these science papers were published
um there's an elliptic curve it's B and
128 that we upgraded to bls2
381 and um by the way we helped ethereum
ad bn18 into ethereum and the Metropolis
upgrade uh so now we have different
elliptic curves from each other but
whatever that's probably fine uh and
then there's the implementation which is
just open source library that anyone can
use there older implementation is called
lib snark and the new implementation
that we wrote over the last two years
and we've now deployed is called Bellman
uh the Old One's written in in C and
assembly except we never use the
assembly because assembly is
dangerous uh and the new one's written
in Rust which is even safer than C and
all of this stuff is reusable for any
zero knowledge proof system and all
bundled together it gives you twice as
fast uh which can be necessary for some
uses
and then the last thing is I think
called a split circuit design which I
probably don't have time to explain but
it gives us another 50% Improvement and
that's how we get down to 2.3 seconds
for a typical transaction that's where
we're at today okay
next um where would we like to go next
well zcash 2.0
sapling
um it's really fantastic uh it might be
good enough for the foreseeable future
but there's at least one thing that
bothers me uh the snarks which is the
proving system that we've started with
all along it has this thing called toxic
waste which why I call toxic waste uh
cryptographers call it a structured
reference string uh but toxic waste is a
much better word because it makes it
clear to you that this is a thing you
should worry about
um if the toxic waste is a unguessable
long random number it's like a private
key
and if you knew it you could Forge zcash
out of thin
air now that's terrible uh but but even
if you knew the toxic waste you can't
violate anyone else's privacy you can
forge new zcash for yourself but you
cannot see or manipulate anyone else or
anyone else's zcash so there's a limit
to how bad it is but it's still pretty
damn bad if you could Forge zcash that
would ruin the whole point um so we went
to this extravagant effort and did I'm
pretty sure the
most secure sophisticated cryptographic
ceremony ever in
2016 to set up the system while
preventing the toxic waste from ever
coming into existence while making it
making sure that nobody at any moment
ever had a chance to generate that
number and then we did a way way more
sophisticated and secure ceremony uh
last this recently this
year uh for the new version so I'm
really sure that the toxic waste can't
possibly exist and a lot of people in
this room actually contributed to that
process to make sure that even if I were
cheating and trying to steal a copy of
the toxic waste they're they would have
prevented me from doing that and vice
versa however this still bothers me
because for one thing I can't convince
everyone else in the world of this they
can there can still be a fud where
someone says I'm I don't know I think
maybe Zuko is saying that but he and a
hundred other random people around the
world were actually secretly in cahoots
uh so it would be cool for zcash as well
as for other uses of zero knowledge
proofs if you could use one of the newer
proving systems which have no toxic
waste um and this slide is all about how
we can't yet in zcash because we need
all of the fields to be green for it to
be efficient enough to put into the
Nakamoto blockchain design where like
the zcash sapling design where every
transaction has to have a zero knowledge
proof generated and then the proof has
to be transmitted with it and verified
by all the minor that puts a lot of
constraints on the performance and the
new things like starx which was a hugely
popular overflow talk Yesterday by Ellie
bin sasan who's one of the zcash
founders uh Starks uh take 45 kilobytes
at least per proof string and that 45
kiloby just we too much to put into the
blockchain with every single transaction
so that's a nonstarter for now
um bottom line is there's only one row
so far uh that we can do this with
um okay so but we so other people could
use Starks for other things that have
different performance constraints um and
uh and we could potentially improve
zcash and like zcash 3.0 with a few
possible techniques that I'll don't
really have time to EXP La here are four
things that you should take a picture of
because I don't have time to talk about
them but they might be useful for zcash
or other zero knowledge proof systems uh
for like the Next
Generation and we have some very rough
estimates of how much savings we could
get so it's like it's close it's
interesting all right I'm just going to
scoot along um here's something else I
totally don't have time to talk about
which is uh what if we change the
architecture okay I have time to talk
about it what if we change the
architecture so it's not a simple
Bitcoin inspired Nakamoto consensus
where you have to generate a zero
knowledge proof with every transaction
and then carry it
along and so what's good about is that
we separated privacy from mining all the
Privacy happens on the enduser computer
who generates an encrypted and zero
knowledge proven transaction and then
all the rest of the consensus algorithm
just deals with these encrypted
blobs but what if we changed it to a new
consensus algorithm
sharding maybe you can use zero
knowledge proofs to solve some of the
problems in some of the currently
unsolved problems in consensus
algorithms in charting uh anything like
that would open up the uh constraints
back here so we could if we had a much
much more high bandwidth consensus
algorithm then we could use Starks even
though they have
like two orders of magnitude greater uh
bandwidth requirements and stuff like
that okay um possible changes uh not
coming anytime soon to zcash because
we're conservative and it took us two
years to upgrade the cryptography it'll
probably take another two years to make
the next
upgrade all right now I mentioned back
here one of the three improvements that
we've already uh vetted and gotten
security Audits and deployed and tested
and then activated on mainnet and now
people are using it today the third one
is split circuit design and it's
specific
to a payment system like zcash it's not
well I don't know if you could if you
could apply the same kind of principle
to other zero knowledge proof systems
but I'll describe it real
quick this is the old zcash 1.0 core
this is um all the bits of data coming
in and out that need to be proven by the
zero knowledge proof you don't have to
understand any of it except for
what these big old things on the
left zxo that's two coins that are being
consumed and two new coins that are
coming out so if you are paying someone
you're probably going to consume a coin
that's worth teny cash and you're going
to give them five and then you're going
to give yourself change for five this is
the so-called utxo data model from
Bitcoin which is different than the
Balan data model from
ethereum so the zero knowledge proof in
the original zcash 1.0 has to prove the
correctness of all of these pieces uh
even if you were only spending one coin
you have to prove the correctness of
that coin and a dummy which takes twice
as long so the split circuit design is
we'll have two proofs one proof that
you're consuming a coin and a different
proof that you're producing a new coin
and that way if you're consuming only
one coin you only you don't have to
prove that you're consuming two coins
and that all by itself is a 50% savings
but the and it's useful for all utxo
style uh systems um earlier I said it's
for transaction systems but the utxo
style might also be useful for um
ethereum style smart contracts there's a
new paper by some scientists that
includes some of the zcash scientists
called zexi
zeex uh which describes how to extend
the zcash style data model and Zer
knowledge approving system to um prove
the validity of arbitrary smart
contracts without uh without having the
miners run all the smart contracts so
instead of the exec instead of someone
submitting a smart contract or executing
a smart contract and all the miners run
it and then they consense on the
resulting output instead the first
person runs it and generates a zero
knowledge proof that this is the correct
output and then all the miners just
verify the validity of the zero
knowledge proof that's uh that's a new
paper
um okay oh good I'm G to have lots of
time for questions I hope you have
questions because I totally lost over
all the complicated stuff in the last
two slides you can ask me about those if
you want all right finally about the
regulatory situation so
um you have probably
heard that
law enforcement and regulators and
governments
uh
fear privacy or that uh privacy
technology like zcash is incompatible
with regulation and I'm here to say
that's totally wrong it's not
incompatible with regulation and the
actual Regulators are not afraid of it
and are not trying to prevent it so
there's this
widespread Miss
like common myth that is uh that is the
actual problem it's not The Regulators
that are the actual problem um here's
the current very simplified state of the
important things in the world which is
that almost everywhere the legal status
of cryptocurrencies in general and zcash
in specific is
ambiguous in China and in India it is
all cryptocurrencies zcash Bitcoin
ethereum Etc are all effectively banned
um and here's a really interesting
little appreciated fact that I want to
tell you in the United States there is a
regulator called the New York Department
of Financial Services which is the most
important regulator of
cryptocurrencies because even though
technically they're only supposed to be
regulating the state of New York but
almost every company who wants to serve
Americans does not want to exclude New
York um and this this regulator the New
York Department of Financial Services
set themselves up as the uh The
Gatekeepers and the Arbiters of all
cryptocurrencies years ago when they
made this thing called the bit
license which
says if you want to if you're a company
you want to sell cryptocurrencies like
you're an exchange or whatever you want
to allow people to trade in
cryptocurrencies and you're serving
citizens of New York regardless of where
you're located if citizens of New York
are among your customers then you
require our prior permission to do
anything that's that's how the bit
license works and um so therefore all
the cryptocurrency companies have been
queuing up to ask this regulator for
permission to do all the things ever
since and here's the little understood
fact that uh that
regulator has approved like about seven
different coins as being legal for
people to serve to the citizens of new
New York and zcash is the seventh one
the most recent one
yeah thanks that's really
important and um and they explicitly
went so far as to put out a press
release under their Like official logo
and the name of their official leader
and superintendent and all that which uh
expressly mentions the
encrypted feature of
zcash um
and when I tell people about this they
sometimes ask me you why did they do
that what are they
thinking um and I don't know for sure
because they didn't make a they didn't
give a justification or an explanation
of their decision in their public press
release and I met with them in private
to
explain uh cryptography to them uh many
times um and they didn't tell me
anything in private either because like
they're the government and they're the
ones who asked the questions
um but one thing I do know is that I've
become very familiar with all the rules
and regulations in the United States and
in Europe and so on um and one thing I
do know is that zcash and cryptography
mixed with blockchains in general is
absolutely compatible with the rules and
regulations as an
exchange or any business that's dealing
like the regulations the way it's
currently done they apply to businesses
like exchanges or financial institutions
they don't apply to program software
developers or individual users but um as
an exchange you can comply with all of
the requirements while supplying
encrypted zcash to your customers that's
that's a fact um so that's something
that the nydfs the New York Department
of Financial Services and my team
discussed and then this really
interesting thing happened where they
called my team back to New York for
another meeting
and I've never talked about this
publicly
before and I thought to myself I think
we covered everything in all the
previous meetings so uh it's not clear
what why they need another Mee maybe
it's to tell us something and uh we all
like filed into the official building in
New York City and we all lined up on the
opposite sides of the official table and
they opened the meeting by
saying the the leader of the nyd s who
was present in the room gestured to
their colleagues and said we all agree
that we don't want the pocketbooks of
our families and the citizens of our
communities to be exposed to everyone on
the
[Applause]
internet yeah so um that's all they ever
said that was it I think that was why we
had that meeting
but I think it really shows that uh
regulators and the rest of us in this
community share a lot of values we want
a safe and prosperous society and we all
want a society in which the citizens
have meaningful political participation
and we want people to be protected from
crime and fraud um and encryption
technology is compatible with all of
that I'm reminded of
25 years ago now when I was playing a
tiny Niche role in an earlier round of
this drama when SSL was being invented
ssl/tls
and at that time the United one small
faction within the United States
government headed by the FBI and Al Gore
and the NSA uh opposed the invention of
SSL CU it might like allow criminals to
use the Internet or something
and that's funny now because 25 years
later the US government requires you to
use SSL right there's a ton of laws
which say if you do not use SSL to
protect your customers then you in
violation in a lot of specific cases and
uh I kind of think that's the same thing
that's going to play out with encryption
on blockchains eventually in hopefully a
lot less than 20 years um all of the
good regulators and all of the good
countries will require this kind of
encryption to protect the people and
lastly I want to say that
uh I myself and everyone involved in the
zcash project is doing this just because
we care about what kind of world we're
building for our children and
grandchildren to grow up in um because
privacy is a human right and it's
necessary for political participation
for Morality and for intimacy and human
relationships and it is not okay for
our societies to
continue kening
into a world where there's pervasive and
intimate violation of everyone's privacy
by one or three centralized actors
that's never been tried before it's
wrong and it's dangerous
[Applause]
thanks and and all of us are part of our
opportunity to change that and to make a
world that's safe and healthy for our
children to grow up
in that's it ready for
questions you got to come down to the or
you got to acquire a mic so that the
people on the live stream can hear the
question thank you um thanks for your
thoughts and I really like how you
actually Twisted that whole thing that
whole thing that people often say about
like think of the children right yeah
but but in in the right way right that's
really good um so I wanted to ask you
what your thoughts are on similar
privacy projects like Monero and I also
wanted to ask you about uh smart
contracts and other features that you
seem to have uh not focused on yet and
if you have any intention to look at
those well those are two big questions
okay so first of all there was a really
great talk talk by zcash founding
scientist Ian Meyers yesterday in which
he laid into Monero um and all all
systems that use what he calls decoy
based privacy
um so you should go watch the live
stream if you haven't or the recording
if you haven't seen it
um now the zero knowledge based privacy
that we have has different problems but
um privacy is really really hard and uh
I wouldn't want it to look like we've
solved it but we've made a substantial
Improvement that everyone needs to learn
from um and I I like to work with them
and arow people on that and we both
benefit from each other um and the other
question was about smart contracts yeah
so it's something that we I we've
deliberately kept out of zcash and kept
out of the public like discussion of the
future of zcash in order to keep things
simple like in theory we could extend
zcash to execute arbitrary smart contra
s and as of about 3 weeks ago maybe a
few scientists that include some of our
scientists published a paper describing
in a lot more detail how that would work
and what the efficiency would be and
what the security properties would be
and so forth uh but so far I kind of
want smart contracts to keep working on
ethereum and just pure private payments
to be the focus of zcash um but that
could
change hey um so besides just winning
the um or educating users about shielded
transactions could you talk a little bit
about the rest of the stars that need to
align across governance business and
technology to make that become a default
whoa um Amber the questioner is a member
of the board of the zcash
foundation
which is a a separate thing from my
company I'm the CEO of the company and
the zcash foundation that Amber is a
director of is a completely sep an
independent thing uh and it sounds like
a question that Amber should answer what
was that aside from inp inside from
educating users governance and business
um oh can I have my slides back I have a
slide about this anyway uh a major the
major touch point between oh yeah thanks
perfect the the premier touch point
between Regulators in the technology and
between users in the technology right
now is
exchanges right this is a map of all of
the exchanges that already um provide
zcash to their users and so they are
actually the most effective both at
educating the users and at educating The
Regulators um note that there are none
in India or China uh there are lots in
us and there are lots in Singapore Hong
Kong
Korea
Etc um
and one more thing that is really
necessary is better ux as everyone I
think has figured out we've all done
this backwards by building the
technology first and then trying to
figure out how to put a user experience
on top of it so now we have to fix that
and make a really good user experience
and then figure how to fit it to the
technology that's my answer any other
questions yeah do you think a connection
between zcash and ethereum is Possible
Oh a connection between zcash and
ethereum oh that's a great question Hey
listen there's this EIP for Blake 2 a
secure hash function uh please please
contact your friendly neighborhood
ethereum developer and tell them that
you support the Blake EIP because that
would be one way to reduce the gas costs
of um of ethereum smart contracts
evaluating the zcash proof of work which
might allow certain kinds of connection
um there's this whole crazy idea that is
not is purely hypothetical but vitalic
brought it up first so I can say it
which is uh zcash and ethereum could
just merge uh so like I don't know how
this would work yeah thanks I appreciate
the support but in the meantime I think
uh people using multiple different
networks and Technologies for different
purposes is the the practice IAL the
pragmatic thing to do um but there there
are a few technal technical ideas for
how we can have decentralized trustless
cross chain interop um and one of the
details that would help is the EIP about
Blake 2 thanks question over
there Hi um I heard you saying a couple
of months ago in a podcast interview
that some approximately 7% of all the
transactions on zikes are shielded um
what's the the state of the shielded
transactions today and what needs to
happen that technically we will see more
of them right so um very so zcash I
didn't get into this zcash supported
backwards compatible um clear text mode
it's like HTTP and https for for a long
long time everyone still supported
HTTP uh but then more and more people
started supporting or even requiring
https similarly zcash allows the old
Bitcoin
style non-private mode and the
questioner was pointing out that most
transactions use only the
old unencrypted mode and What needs to
change so the first there's two things
first of all well three things sorry
it's a lot but first of all the
cryptography which is the whole first
part of my talk is that we needed to
reduce the computation cost from 37
seconds on a laptop down to like a
couple of seconds so that that reduces
the barrier by the way this also reminds
me when SSL was new it was uh expensive
and um you know computers were a lot
weaker back then and that was one of the
reasons why it took so many years for
SSL to become ubiquitous but uh the
other one is all these exchanges need to
start supporting all these exchanges
need to start supporting the encrypted
mode in order to protect their users and
they need to understand which they
mostly don't because of this fud they
don't realize that the Regulators are
almost certainly okay with that they
just need to tell The Regulators this is
user protection it's compatible with all
of the regulations and we need to do it
to protect users so uh after you contact
your friendly neighborhood ethereum
developer contact your friendly
neighborhood cryptocurrency exchange and
say you want encrypted shielded
transactions like SSL instead of HTTP in
order to protect
you uh the last thing is
ux like we're making a new wallet and
stuff I didn't have time to get into
any more
questions hi thanks for moving this
project forward um so I have a question
about um so say you are doing a service
for the business where the business um
resolve their transactions payments and
of course yeah there is this notion of
privacy that you know um counterparties
they different parties they don't know
they don't want to know about like with
who the business is done so perfect use
case um um do you think that or up to
your knowledge if um on the for the tax
reasons um some regulatory or the tax
Authority could come and ask to the
service provider so let's say in this
case uh which is built on top of the Z
Cas uh to uh unreveal all the details
about like a certain uh entity okay I
think I understand the question um if
you have encrypted transactions on a
public blockchain like zcash uh can some
party in your case it's a tax Authority
uh come ask some other party to review
some of the
transactions uh yes this is a
really ill appreciated fact about
encryption encryption doesn't give you
all dark all the time where no one can
see anything what encryption gives is
selective disclosure of data so zcash is
the first ever thing that it combines
the blockchain properties of canonical
appendonly data
with the encryption properties which is
that if you have the decryption key that
lets you see some of the data in the
blockchain you can give that decryption
key to a third party and then they can
see that data in the
blockchain see what I mean that's really
interesting um yeah so it's subtle but
the bottom line is it's possible to
reveal data to some parties without
revealing it to unauthorized parties in
the blockchain which is good yeah but
that would require to share the private
key no not the not the key that allows
you to spend money a different key that
allows you to see the
transactions um but not to spend the
money make
sense hey Zuko you talked a little about
the regulatory landscape and the ban in
India do you have any like more insights
to share or anecdotes from what's going
on out there uh from a regulatory persp
it's not too much my place to say I mean
the
the the government of India banned um
Banks from serving Bitcoin companies in
India several weeks ago and then just a
few days ago the most terrible thing
happened uh one of those Indian Bitcoin
exchanges which is one of the longest
serving Bitcoin exchanges in the world
um they set up since they were since the
banks had been required to cut them off
they set up ATMs that would take rupees
in paper and give you
Bitcoins okay
uh because that was like the only
remaining legal thing for them to do and
then the most horrible thing happened
about two weeks ago is that they were
arrested which doesn't make any sense
under the law any law that I've heard I
don't know what's going
on so that's uh that's the last thing I
heard about
India thank
you Zuko as somebody who thinks about
privacy all the time um and can you
paint a picture for us um let's say you
know projecting from today to end years
into the future how would decentralized
applications actually provide privacy
for people not just on the transaction
level but on many different levels yeah
um that's that
technology it's possible technologically
and there's this thing called zexi zexe
which is a
science uh paper that describes
a technology that could accomplish
something along those lines um it's
possible cryptographically speaking to
um have shared you know distributed apps
which you get the um the property you
want I don't know the right word for it
but the property that you know the app
is going to do the right thing and it
can't be like subverted by the owner of
the server since there's no server uh
you can have a distributed app which
when you use it you don't don't have to
link what you're doing to anything else
about you you don't even have to
necessarily reveal the moves you're
making within the app so it's a lot of
work no one's actually implemented it
yet but scientifically it's
possible why do you think the uh
adoption of zcash on darket markets has
been almost zero and is that something
that bothers you or do you not really
care why do I think the adoption of
zcash on Dark Net markets is almost zero
and is that something that bothers
me I think my you know my best guess is
so I mean part of it is I've made some
uh tweets saying uh screw you criminals
go away this isn't for you and um and
that doesn't
really change the scientific or the
open- source code but I honestly think
because I I heard this from someone who
studies like the criminal underground
that criminals don't trust zcash because
they don't trust
me and that doesn't bother me I think
that's that's good it's like the dark
net markets are a shitty uh a shitty
early adopter Market because they're
they're small you you wouldn't make they
wouldn't be very active users it's a
tiny little minority and then it would
turn off the rest of mainstream Society
who would associate you with crime and
drugs and whatever so it doesn't bother
me uh so uh how how uh the cas is
expanding in Japan uh there are some
Outlets which can legally accept
currencies put on balance sheets are
there any obstacles for uh wide adoption
into fear world because of this privacy
I didn't understand the beginning of the
question how how is zash what yeah so
are there any obstacles from regulators
and um other authorities to use the cash
uh in Japan where Japan yes in
Japan uh where the cryptocurrencies are
allowed to be used for buy and sell Lo
local Goods there the there is an
obstacle which
is
the there's a a Japanese self-regulatory
organization which is the Japanese
exchanges
um that have
published a
draft uh proposal for how they think the
government ought to regulate them which
uh says that the government should
require them not to supply
zcash and I think that's a mistake on
their part is that they like a lot of
people incorrectly think that encryption
is incompatible with consumer protection
and um AML kyc processes and uh computer
security and all that
uh so I'm hoping that uh they
will notice the example of nydfs doing
the opposite um maybe they'll even learn
from the example of https 25 years ago
but um that's currently in play so so
Japan is gray on the map because it's
not it's an ongoing conversation right
now it's not settled
okay no more questions thank you very
much for being
[Applause]
here for